The special meeting has some interesting debate over funding for the final EIS studies that are mandatory before going to the State and Feds for monies to make exit 4A a reality.
As a councilor who has been here for almost 6 years, I can tell you that I thought I knew most of the 4 A history and how it has become the single biggest political issue in Derry for well over 20 years and Just like the delaying of the widening of I93 because of legal stalling tactics, the projects end up costing us more in the long run. But lets stop for a second and really look at the issues and not the same old scare tactics the ADT group applies to grow their own ranks. I realize now that after a meeting with a Boston North representative and all the documents they possess and the town does not ( whole new story there) that I can say with certainty the following statements.
#1) The town has already obligated itself to spending $5 Million Dollars back in the late 80's by two prior Mayors and boards of selectman. There is documentation to prove this.
#2)Just because the total costs which is estimated to be around $30 million to complete the off ramp DOES NOT mean Derry will have to pay any more than its obligations. ( That is, IF no lawsuit comes up on the town for reneging on its obligation. Then in my opinion, we could be on the hook for a whole lot more.)
Lesson learned is Londonderry tries to back out and was sued and lost in a court of law which cost the Londonderry taxpayers an additional 1.5 Million in damages and told they must contribute their $5 million.
#3)The new exit will allow for Rte 102 downtown to escape heavy traffic burdens now and in the future. Projections for future growth in Derry and Auburn/Chester will effect the flow of traffic in our downtown.
#4) Southern NH Planning Commission has exit 4A as a high priority on its list. This is the regional planning board which is important to gaining fed dollars.
So, no matter how you slice it, whether or not you personally support or don't support 4A, it comes down to the fact that we are obligated to pay for this. We have not expended the 5 Million dollars and the last vote was for $600K which comes out of the total we owe to this project.
Lets stop kicking this political football around to scare townspeople and understand its not in our best interest to halt funding until we have reached our obligations because to do so would place a burden on the taxpayers of Derry.
And lastly, why some councilors were quick to criticize others for going to this meeting with Boston North is beyond me. 4 councilors went ( not 3 as the UL reported) Why would any councilor NOT want to go to see the full history, look at all the documents and make a judgement based on knowing the FULL story is beyond me.
Janet said in the meeting on the TIFF that she didn't do her homework when she voted for it and then voted against, why would she make the same mistake by not viewing the whole issue herself and follow Kevins lead by refusing to go? Only they can answer that question.
What are your thoughts on this subject?
The opinions expressed are of my own individualy and are not to be interpreted as official of any governing body. Comments from readers are also of their own opinions and will be edited only if the content is harmful or non constructive to any individual. It is important to share information and thoughts on political process so that we may discuss issues that effect us all.
90 comments:
My comments remain the same:
Coyle is a self serving and dishonest, if not evil, pol; the epitome of why lawyers should not represent Derry in official town capacities. Like morticians, we should call lawyers when we need one.
Charter objection my butt Kevin!
His asking what Boston North’s stake is in discussions with Derry, over and over, shows an obvious lack of reality or chasing rainbows in disbelieving the documentation exists that commits Derry to follow-through on past commitments. It all smacks of his manipulation of the Wal-Mart investment in infrastructure for Rt. 28, that we now are bonding. Of course the collective memory in Derry will let him off again.
ADT, save your histrionics on why Wal-Mart is no good for Derry. We have been there and I disagree with your assessments.
Janet continues to not have an original thought in her big block head. She simply mimics Coyle’s every wish. Why there are people who cannot comprehend that
The widening of 93 opens a once in a lifetime opportunity to get Exit 4A done. Coyle and others should be working with the state to develop the governmental investment in the exit as was done with exit 3 in Windham.
But no, just the opposite, he and Janet are working against it. How good is that for Derry?
The tail is wagging the dog. Boston North should have come before the council as a whole, in public or private. The whole council should be there.
BC - as President of the ADT, I'd like to know what scare tactics you are referring to? We are trying to grow our ranks to improve citizen awareness of issues that face the town and this is a big one. We are also trying to increase voter turnout. Those are our goals, so what is so scary?
Everyone has their own opinion on 4A which is fine. The facts are the facts but when we're talking about this kind of money being spent, discussion and debate is needed and healthy.
In my opinion the EIS is costing way more than it should. Given the fact that the state does not have 4A on it's 10 year plan, and the current firm providing the EIS has not produced a deliverable and are in what I believe to be an open ended contract, it is in their best interest to spend as much as they can. If we're going to let them do that, then shame on us.
Why won't Boston North meet with the full town council? It seems to me there may be something they don't want made part of the public record. Again, just my opinion but are we supposed to take your word for it and not ask questions?
I liked Brent's idea of a citizen oversight committee. But that would mean opening up information for review by some whose opinion may differ from yours, and maybe that's what is scary.
Hello Steph,
The scare tactics that I refer to is when Members tell the taxpayers that this will cost them 30,40 50 Million dollars. Who ever said that? We are committed to only the 5 Million that prior elected officials approved.
As far as the EIS goes, we had one and then it had to be revised because of the CLF lawsuits that slowed down Rte 93 widening and again each time someone drags progress...taxpayerss take it in their wallets. The facts are that the 4A exit could of been done back in 91/92 but because of the taxpayers group ( DTA ) back then, it costs everyone more money. The fact is that someone in town hall in 91/92 somewhere files went missing. However, Boston North has all their files and each councilor was asked to meet and look over these docs.. Some councilors refused. Why? Also I agree and are happy that you and many others want to know more, however it always appears that your group only wants to put faith in its own member councilors are close friends.
When did you and Mr.Benson become lawyers.
I'm not real confident in having you and a couple of store owners making this kind of call for us without consulting a real lawyer.
Please hire a lawyer that specializes in this type of thing and have them look at the documents you and Boston North are talking about.
If a law firm is not allowed to look at the documents you are talking about then we don't need to worry about it.
The lawyer you have now can't give you a good answer on if a road is public or private so please use someone else, preferably someone from A firm in Boston.
Stop spending our money on things people want and only give us what we need.
We must everything in derry come to loggerheads? They have files we need to see them.
Who cares who has to go to whom? Just organize a sitdown and get it done.
Steph,
Why is this a Boston North issue? You are obviously taking direction from Kevin on this. If they have documentation cementing Derry's obligation to pay, what difference does it make whether they meet with all counselors? meeting with 2 or more is in my mind like meeting with all.
Who is Boston North or at least who is behind them? Who are the owners? Any local ownership? Any potential conflicts of interest here?
A google search of this company shows a Hudson address, but not much more.
Something tells me there are some very, VERY sweaty palms out there.
The towns Boston North documents have inexplicably disappeared from in the towns archives.
Boston North will not meet with the council, and the council members that have a clue understand that it is wrong to meet with Boston North privately given we may have been informally threatened with a lawsuit.
So here we are once again. Derry's legacy of mismanagement continues.
Let it go to discovery and see whether any town officials may have acted beyond their legal authority. It could explain why some who support 4A are so insistent.
Smacks of DEDC like transparency, don'tcha think?
Dear Rick Metts,
When are you going insist on decorum with this council? Anyone familiar with Mr Neil Wetherbee knows he is slightly off. However, what constructive purpose does it serve to allow Mr. Wetherbee to call a fellow councilor " ignorant" with not so much as a peep from the chair?
Mr. Metts it is time that you insist publically, that Mr. Wetherbee apologize publically, for his affront to Mr. Coyle who was victimized by Mr. Wetherbee's true ignorance and instability.
Sincerely,
The thousands of Derry voters that support Kevin Coyle and Council Decorum.
Why would anyone want to bankrupt this town by paying out $5,000,000 on something we do not need?
Brian You indicate you met with the Boston North people. Who are they?
Mr. Metts,
You are doing a great job under trying circumstances.
Signed,
The thousands of Derry citizens who do notcare for the Coyle/Fairbanks histrionics
If the town is actually going to be forced to spend the $5 Million as is reported, then it probably makes sense for the town to come together and start supporting this Exit 4A proposal so we can attract the needed federal and state money that will be required to actually build this thing. Otherwise we are just throwing away our money and the squabbling will drag this on and on.
If it turns out that we don't have to spend the $5 Million well then that changes the situation. Seems like we need a definitive ruling and only way to get that is likely a court case.
The NH S.O.S lists Boston North Associates, Inc. as "Disolved" back in 1994.
The initial registered agent listed is Paul A. Villemaire and the incorporator listed is Christos A. Katsikas.
I want to thank Brian for his friendly advice "if we don't vote on this , we will be sued".
That sure makes me feel better than hearing those ADT scare tactics that this exit could possibly cost the Town of Derry $30 million.
"We have to do it or we'll be sued."
This whole Boston North thing is a sideshow and entering into that argument begins to acknowledge defeat of the project on its own merits.
I favor exit 4A on its merits and I think the vast, vast majority of people in Derry do as well. The bogus question on the ballot 2 years ago made no mention of the incredible benefits of the project. And with the slanted question, it barely lost.
2:33 Please quantify these "incredible benefits", you know like those of us in the private sector do. What will the Return On Investment be? Less B.S., more defensible numbers please.
And thanks for reminding us that the people of Derry already voted NO on the project.
Burtis was exposed tonight for the fraud that he is. He kept saying taxes went up 9%. He repeated it several times until Benson correctly pointed that the rate went up but values wnet odwn, making his statement false.
I usually disagree with Doug Newell, but figure he means well. Tonight I changed my view of him when he threatened to sue the Town over his taxes. It was a cry for publicity. In TV terms its called 'jumping the shark'. there is no going back.
One can apply for a tax abatement. Then if denied a person can go to court if they feel an injustice has been done. To blurt out I will see you in court is childish and beneath someone who wants to be in the public eye.
If Burtis were to sue the Town of Derry over his taxes, wouldn't the town have to pay for lawyers for its defense? Wouldn't that come from.....now let's see.....oh taxes!?
The man's an idiot. People need to stop listening to his whining. Perhaps when he becomes a teenager he will grow-up. Oh wait...that ship has already sailed. Oh well, guess I will just ignore him.
I had attacked Douggie over the summer so that the "Folks" could see the deeper, darker sole within.
Agree with Douggie or "I will see you in court."
Yep I want him to have a hand in the school budget! What is the matter Doug, Gomez find the pool?
In my previous post, I attributed the comments to Burtis, I meant to say Newell. My apologies.
Good info here on the CLD site - including plans and even a price tag estimate of $24-$30 Million in the last presentation from 2007 for anyone interested in reading up on the history of Exit 4A.
http://www.cldengineers.com/updates_londonderryexit.htm
Looks like the State might be eyeing revenue from an I93 toll to provide $10 Million towards Exit 4A. See link.
http://www.nh.gov/dot/org/projectdevelopment/planning/typ/documents/I-93FundingFactSheet10-14-09.pdf
Shea Porter has asked for $104 Million for Exit 4A.
http://www.shea-porter.house.gov/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=343&Itemid=79
anon 3:30
Maybe that will answer Brad's question of where the $30 million dollar number came from. Guess it wasn't just made up afterall.
Carol Shea Porter and $104MM for Exit 4a?
#1. Moonbat
#2. Face for Radio
#3. Moonbat
#4. I want a Ferrari for Christmas(but probably will not get one)
Difference between me and CSP?:
I know I am not going to get the Ferrari. The $104 large for herin 2010: Not so much!
See #3
I think I just witnessed a segue that cannot be believed!
Did Councilor Fairbanks just ask for some trees to cover a mound at the old town dump in her neighborhood after acting like a total pill ( her usual board personality) regarding the Exit 4A Boston North monies?
Maybe my Tivo skipped a beat and time got compressed. Can someone comment please?
Brad's "made up." Everything we hear from Brad has been made up, and not by Brad.
Brad is being told by Boston North what will happen should the town of Derry insist on knowing what we are signing on for.
The golden rule is "he who has the gold rules"; aren't we paying for services rendered and if so why are we buckling under pressure from a contractor without our entire community and entire council knowing what if any relationship exists?
Brad is not a thinker, Brad is a pawn.
So that's the new figure $104,000,000? Holy ....!!! Stop the insanity!
I love living in a democracy but must Al Dimmock comment on everything?
Is his opinion really that important to anybody but himself?
no new posts in a while
Anonomous 1:10 PM, your Tivo works fine.
It is your mind that skipped a few relavent facts; like the cost differential that exists between the 4A fools paradise and some tree's that may help conceal an unkept parcel of land.
As for the time compression, well, not to worry. What you experienced was actually vertigo; produced by your head whipping around aimlessly, like a video game tank turret, taking pot shots at Mrs. Fairbanks.
She has really been a tough target to hit hasn't she? That because she backs her positions up with logic, as opposed to your preferrred method of taking shots in the dark.
It never ends. Yet another council majority guttless wonder who weighs in with gibberish that amount to nothing more than a cheap shot at one of the only councilors that represents her constituents. Pathetic.
8:31,
Did you have a brownie for breakfast or did janet stop short?
Pathetic is your slavish devotion to this ugly duckling.
If it is ok to spend money only on kevins and janets projects one wonders if Walmart should have been places in west derry and exit a should have been called 3b?
anon 31/10/09 1:10 PM
Maybe you should pay better attention next time you watch a council meeting or rewind your tivo and watch it again. How about going to an actual meeting? Janet was asking about the trees that are along the fence of the old dump, not asking to have trees put on the "mound" as you claim. Janet also brought up this issue at the meeting the week before, you must have missed that one.
Some people on this blog need to find something else to do with their time besides bashing other people. Have you got any ideas how we can get Concord to NOT take away the $7.4 million of school funding next year? What are your thoughts on Pinkerton building the new $23 million 'freshman building'? Cost of insurance for the Derry school district? Are you OK with the $600,000 approved for exit 4A? All of these are going to affect our taxes, but you are more concerned with putting others down.
This town might be in a better position if people used this blog for ideas and solutions instead of taking pot shots at others and hiding behind anonymous. If you feel you need to bash others, at least have the guts to put your name on your post and not be a coward.
Brain, why do you allow these types of postings, they are of no help to anyone, unless of course you like to see other councilors and citizens badmouthed. Please help clean up your blog and let's work on solutions to our towns problems, not make them worse.
Thank You
Please say it isn't true!!! Do not even think of buying this land in East Derry. I just read a newspaper article saying the councilors are thinking of buying land. This is ridiculus. Brian I hope you plan on voting no. We can not afford this. If people in this neigborhood want it let them put a bid in for it. They were ok with it becoming a subdivision before. Don't even think of it!!!
Oh Great!
Another country heard from. Thanks Jeff. Spoken like a true ADT lapdog.
If the purpose of the blog does not live up to your standards then it is only about complaining, taking potshots and being a coward. We went through this 3 months ago with Carl and the pilot.
Blogs are about effecting change.
In my case the change is getting people to see Janet as what she is not the great statesman you consider her because she conforms to your political views. You agree with her so you feel free to use your name. I vehemently disagree with her positions and have seen, first hand, her vindictive and unprofessional behavior to those in public that she disagrees with. I am a coward because I choose not to have this cubic ferret gnawing at my ankles?
You took a stand against the emergency services. Good for you. I think that your stand was more about skipping on a bill that you did not think was fair. But you wrapped yourself in the flag (or your wife did) and drove the town to justice. Of course the taxpayer picked up the tab but don’t let niggling little facts get in the way of a good story.
The town would be better off if little miss Fairbanks occupied her time elsewhere. That is my opinion and my right to express. Brian’s blog is just the conduit ( do you really want him to edit everything comrade??) so do not kill the messenger. Being a blog, it offers anonymity so I do not have to endure retribution. That’s the way it works in the electronic age big guy!
I could not agree with Jeff Hooton more.
First off, I do not know Jeff Hooton, so there is no conspiracy, but in my view his observations and suggestions are spot on.
His condemnation of this blog's more than ample supply of "anonymous" cowards has long detracted from it's potential to do good.
Brian and I have respectfully discussed this many times. To his credit, BC has on occasions made corrections, but it still remains far from perfect.
My favorite BC blog "anonymous" poster is Derry's own "anonymous pilot." When his head is not in the clouds, this gem can be seen driving around in a pick up truck. "Anonymous pilot" chooses to hide as "anonymous." For example, he recently presented his half baked arguement that taxation has no impact on home prices. I guess on one level, after reviewing his posts, I can't blame him for not attaching his name to it. He also seems to be intolerant of those that take the time and interest to speak at town council meetings. Derry sure needs more folks like our cowardly "anonymous pilot" to move things forward.
Bottomline, Jeff Hooton thank you for calling a spade a spade.
C. V. Accardo
Anon 12:24, thank you for publicly presenting your unique brand of unwitting evidence in support of my contention, that Derry is truly a "diverse" if not challenged community.
Be advised, I am not referring to "diverse" in terms of race, color, creed or economics in your case. Don't hurt yourself figuring out my meaning........if need be, I am sure one of the council majority, or even Derry's own "anonymous coward pilot", will lend you a hand in figurin' things out if after a while you find yourself scratching.
By the way, I attempted to casually read your post, but found I had to decipher it. Anon 12:24, the good habit of proof-reading is generally exercised by an author of a piece of writing PRIOR to it's submission to the public domain.
"Oh great"......another art lost on you and most of the good people ghost writers, that post up unfiltered and unattributed townie logic for public consumption on good ole Brian's blog.
CVA
anon 12:24
Guess when you don't like the message, you have to attack the messenger.
If you think Brian doesn't censor these posts, think again. He does.
Thank you for taking the time to look up who I am and my wife. Did you ever think that the court case with the town may have been "about effecting change"? Hopefully the finance department has changed the way they handle ambulance billings so this doesn't happen again. At least we were out in the open and not hiding in the closet so someone like you can be a "cubic ferret gnawing at my ankles".
So go on ignoring all the major issues facing the taxpayers while you continue to berate others who you disagree with. And while you sit around tonight thinking of other ways to put me down, I will be at an ADT meeting where we'll be working to help save the taxpayers some money, even you.
Your favorite "big guy"
Carl,
Your posts are textbook tortured syntax. Lighten up on 12:24. His/her posts make your writing style look wanting!
Signed: English Teacher
Jeff and Carl,
You have both exhibited the ugly truth of life in Derry.
Jeff please do not inflate your ego and think that you needed to be “searched.” I was at that particular Town Council meeting and watched the ADT docu-drama “The great ambulance caper”. Hooten is not exactly difficult to find on the ADT website.
You both extol the virtues of ADT elite (although Doug stated that Carl is a holdout):
• Jeff with his free ambulance ride: Note when Gandhi protested the salt tax he did not ask for the salt and pepper to be passed at dinner. You could have made your point Jeff AND paid the bill. Instead you let the taxpayer pick up the tab.
• Coyle always wants to use lawyers to stop things that he disagrees with. Keep it in the profession? Hey, it takes money to save money, right?
• Newell disagrees with his tax bill and immediately says (in public) see you in court! Would it be a conflict of interest if he had Coyle represent him?
• Of course Janet wants her trees in West Derry to make up for all the slights in West Derry’s distant past, ant to make sure she has something on her Tuesday calendar.
• Al wants his tax bill lowered to 1981
• Burtis wants whatever he wants although it is often so convoluted that one wonders if he could ever be happy if he got it
• Carl you just love to hate anonymity! While harnessing your anger with someone that disagrees with you please compare our TOTAL tax bill with the desirable, leafy towns in Mass. (I will help you here Carl: Lexington, Weston, Duxbury, Manchester and Wenham. Special note: Carl look at the total tax, not just the rate!) Hopefully you feel a little better.
So while the ADT cloisters at their meeting tonight, dreaming up new ways to prevent monies being spent for the betterment of all under the guise of fiscal responsibility, don’t lose sight of the fact that they do find ways to spend tax dollars.
If the ADT thinks that Derry (with current population) it can save it’s way to prosperity with the tax rate of Dixville it will be a very short meeting. (Hint: don’t let the widening of Rt.93, the first major infrastructure improvement that touches Derry since the Kennedys built the bloody thing, pass us by.)
Hey Carl.........
Anonymous
Oh great!! Now we have a cowardly "Anon english teacher" to contend with.
You are not a teacher in the Derry school district......are you?? To the best of my knowledge the Derry school district staff encourages students to sign their own work.
In any event, you are apparently well read enough to identify a deliberate writing style but not well enough to recognize when used to emphasize a point.
Actually, your post echos the thought process of many past and current town politicians. That is, you are willing to substitute form for substance.
Oops, here I go again, more tortured syntax....I hope you comprehend the substance.
CVA
ANON 10:30, thank you so much for your silly little reference to leafy towns in Massachusetts.
For the record, I grew up in a leafy town in Mass. named Winchester. In fact, I still pay taxes there on TWO properties!!.....imagine that.
I also owned property and lived for over many years in yet another leafy town you may have heard of named Andover. Small world, isn't it?
There are other properties, but I won't bother you with the details.
So anon 10:30, in light of the fact that I still actually own property in Mass., what exactly are you in the position to tell me about tax bills in desirable leafy towns in Massachusetts?
Should you care to discuss the topic further I would be thrilled to compare notes. But to be honest, something about you choosing to post as "anonymous" predisposes me not to hold my breath.
BTW, i am not "angry" with, nor do I "hate" those that choose to sit in the stands drinking beer and eating hot dogs, all the while anonymously calling the athletes on the field less than flattering names.
Frankly, I have lived my life on the "field." Should some anonymous beer drinking hot dog eater call me a name, I consider the source....for all of a milisecond......and they disappear..... anonymously.
CVA
p.s. One thing is for certain, citizens of leafy towns in Massachusetts would not stand for some of the costly SOP rationale that exists in Derry. The Derry "that's the way we've always done it" mantra has cost this community dearly.
Carl,
I am an English teacher but not in Derry. Home with the flu.
Written expression should never compromise on form even for substance.
Excuse my frankness but I fail to see the value in your compromise as your substance was minimal at best.
English teacher
This web page has been slow until now.Some angry people out there.Looks as if someone is upset over losing an election or some failed economic company or something.Beat up those who beat you.Never let on who you are so you look better.Its obvious whos side you are on.You never complain about some people- the people who supported you.Friends of bc is the best way to describe your type.It makes funny reading.On with the show
CVA- you were over the top with "I play on the field' bit. I too own property in Andover and Winchester. I own a company based in Winchester. Although you and I own the other properties it does not give us an edge on Derry's politics. Everyone is entitled to his/her opinions.
BC-I used to check the blog every day. Now its updated every week. Could you please make an effort to publish the posts in a more timely manner? If people do not see updates regularly they will drift away and the blog will become irrelevant.
10:11,
Will do a better job in updating this! system has had some problems and i have not stayed on top of it. I will now though.
Thanks
Heard that we may have out of towners and even out of staters possibly sending their kids to Derry schools. Pay no taxes but sending their kids here for better education. Anyone know if this is legit? If true and if caught we should sue for reimbursement from these folks.
Anon 10:11, do me the favor of referring back to the OP where yet another one of your types, i.e. anonymous, erroneously put forth a Wetherbeesque "ignorant" comment regarding my lack of knowledge of Massachusetts tax burdens. My response was only natural given my direct multiple year experience with the topic.
Once you have honestly made an attempt to bring yourself up to speed by reviewing the pertinent posts, then I would like you to defend your position citing exactly where I in any way suggested I have an "edge" on Derry politics. I look forward to your reply. If you don't reply, no problem, you know what I think about beer swigging hot dog eaters especially anonymous ones.
As you know, Winchester is a small community with a very, VERY small commercial presence. What biz are you in....anonymous 10:11?????
Best of luck to you.
Anon english teacher, I am sorry to hear you are not feeling well.
Given you have taken some time off, maybe you could offer some specifics in your next post rather than vague off topic generalities.
Frankly, it is you that has twice failed to say anything of substance. All you have managed to say is that you do not understand that writing takes many forms. In fact, in my experience, I have found that "good" writing form is often compromised for substance.....think poetry anon english teacher......but that is a topic for another forum.
Sounds to me like you may be suffering from a form of the Derry "this is how we've always done it" syndrome. By adhering to literary and/or political dogma rather than evaluating new ideas and approaches you are missing much. And in the case of Derry costing us more.
Same rules apply to you as the "anon pilot"and now "anon winchester biz owner", that is, unless you have something specific and on point to say, spare me and everyone else the time and trouble of reading your post.....I will do the same.
p.s. You never did answer my question teacher, do you require your students to sign their work or is hypocracy okay with you?
CVA
Carl,
My point was and remains, that people live where they see value. Your contention was that property values alone determine housing decisions and I have told you are full of BS regardless of your blogisphere bullying. BTW bullying is obviously how you got along in life (life on the field) but the internet equalizes us all Carl. Can’t bully here.
The Calculus of value is individual in nature. You have property in Winchester. Another in Derry. There must be some reason why.
I have several properties myself. But I chose Derry to raise my kids due to Pinkerton as my wife did not want my children to go to private school. I need good access to the world beyond Exit 4 and I never wanted my kids to need to cross a street when they were young and out playing. The property taxes, although unpleasant were acceptable for the QUALITY OF LIFE we wanted. Others on my street joined us and their value calculation was similar.
The leafy towns got to be that way because of keeping a strong quality of life , good schools and the demand for homes high raising property values. There have always been less expensive town to live in besides Winchester, but unless you inherited the property, you made the decision to purchase there instead of Woburn or Somerville. Why? A safe bet is that you probably could not afford Wenham or Lexington. If you could have, you would have property there, again due to the value and quality of life.
So the question for Derry is how to become the most desirable place to live in our area? How do we maximize the value of the quality of life Derry provides? Simply by lowering the tax rate? I think not. At the end of the day when you are not focused on thumping your chest of re-living your glory days, neither do you.
The simple solutions for Al Dimock to return to his 1981 tax bill or the other old taxpaying buck on the blog that wants Derry to revert back to cow grazing days, don’t exist in the real world. Town Government idiots of the past let the condexes and apartments get constructed. The population swelled and once here, you have to service the people and educate their children at ever escalating costs. So we can’t shrink our way to leafiness Carl.
America’s new socialism means that there are WPA projects abound. The money will be spent elsewhere so we might as well dip an oar in the water and work with CSP and Concord to help build and finance the infrastructure Derry needs to increase the quality of life for the future not the past. All the ADT parliamentary maneuvering, implemented by Coyle and his trusty parrot, can’t return us to the past.
anon 17/11/09 10:11 AM
"If people do not see updates regularly they will drift away and the blog will become irrelevant."
This blog already is irrelevant. Nothing useful comes from it. It just shows that Derry is full of nameless bitter cry babies. No wonder businesses don't want to come here. Why would they want to get stuck in all the BS. Oh wait, Tractor Supply did come, but they sell shovels to handle what comes out of cows.
CVA 17/11/09 12:49 PM
If you don't reply, no problem, you know what I think about beer swigging hot dog eaters especially anonymous ones.
___________________________________
Your argument does not get stronger with insults. It actually shows inmaturity. I stand behind my belief that just because we own properties in 'leafy communities' of MA, our opinions are no more valid than others. I believe we are all equal. I have an office on Mt. Vernon Street and additional warehouse space off of Cross in Winchester. You are correct that the business community is small. I prefer to remain anonymous for numerous reasons. If that takes me off your playing field, I am satisfied.
Anon 3:59, you too are invited to prove your latest fabrication "anonymous pilot." Refer us all to where I said "property value alone determine housing decisions." While you are at it, you might want to sit in the corner of a round room, you may find that sooner.
Given that you have so utterly distortion my position on taxation, that it now borders on a lie, I challenge you to show me I have stated as such.
You are just a small part of a big problem in this town. You are either unwilling or incapable of honest open dialogue. Rather, you resort to BS that resonates in the affirmative to the LCD from which you surfaced, truth be damned.
Sorry if you feel bullied by this post but the truth is a standard that I for one never compromise on. Something you should consider carefully it seems.
CVA
Anon 12:49, you still have not cited where I suggested or directly stated that because I own property in other towns it gives me an edge in Derry politics which is YOUR original contention.
All I hear are crickets......
Why am I not surprised.....
CVA
CVA,
Before we moved to Derry, we looked at houses in Londonderry and Hampstead.
Through that experience, I accept as fact that we got alot more house for my buck in Derry than we would have in those other towns - about $30K more house to put a number on it.
I do feel that my taxes are the about the same as they would be if I could have afforded the similar (quality) but more expensive home in those other communities. (Add the $30K to the value times a lower tax rate and bingo, I come up with the about the same number as Derry bills me).
I have respectfully asked you to address this viewpoint in the past; did I miss your response?
In this regard, why is Derry a bad deal?
CVA, you should start your own blog. Instead of replying here with wise ass answers you can have a whole blog to yourself. Why the animosity toward anyone who disagrees with you? Did you get picked on as a kid?
We agree that Winchester has a small business community. I asked around about you, and no one has heard of you. I guess that field you play on is not as big as your ego.
Anon 1:30, in my case, on many levels, East Derry was a very good deal. I am thrilled you feel the same way about your home purchase decision.
What concerns me is that Derry real estate valuation IS disporportionately losing ground in relationship to surrounding communities. In my view, this is due in part to the impact of our materially higher property tax burden. Please refer to my 09-02-09, 12:20PM post as a point of reference.
As I outlined back in September, the 38% property tax delta that accrues to Derry's detriment vs. Londonderry, results in a 10% negative home valuation differential. Going forward, this delta can either be reduced or as my 15 years experience in Derry would indicate, will likely expand.
Need proof??
Take a look at the expenses this town council has approved during this past year. Then look at the massive expenses and revenue losses barreling down on us as of this writing. Are these expenses and revenue losses going to reduce your tax bill thereby making your home more valuable??
I know some people don't like to hear this but Derry's tax escalation is occuring (except in Windham) at a greater rate than neighboring communities.....in fact, most communities are materially cutting expenses and/or deferring expenditures; favorable financing and material costs arguments notwithstanding BC.
Bottomline, I am certain you would agree at some point a community's property tax burden becomes a competitive disadvantage. That you purchased your home before this tipping point was reached and still have market appreciation equity, I say congratulations. That you have "more home" in Derry than had you purchased in a surrounding town, I can't take issue with that........but the future counts.
Failure to acknowledge that home valuations could get worse......much worse if we continue on this course in Derry is irresponsible and leaves much to chance.
I for one believe Derry has reached an inflection point. If we fail to realistically address the rising property tax tide, we risk systemically widening, at an increasing rate, the differential in home valuations that exists between Derry and it's surrounding communities.
Remember, mortgage debt service is P&I AND taxes. Every incremental dollar that a prospective home buyer spends on taxes, is a dollar not spend on P&I. This translates into a lesser value spent on your home.
I hope this answers your question. I thank you for your civility. I do however wish you would consider coming out of your anonymous shell. Take it from me, you have nothing to worry about should some knit-wit anonymously take a pot shot at you.......these "types" are generally off target by their very nature.
CVA
Carl,
What has happened to you? Have you lost your mind?
I am your fabled anon pilot. Although a pilot, I am not as you have wrongly assumed, a commercial pilot. I am a multiple business owner and fly myself to client meetings throughout the world. I would not own an airline stock. Every guess you have made about me you have assessed totally wrong. Coward? I have over 200 air combat missions in the Persian Gulf War. Your service to the country has been….? Drive a pickup truck ? I do own several but not in this country. Makes seeing me driving one in Derry problematic.
People buy homes for many reasons beyond tax rate. Tax rate is but one determinate. The more desirable the town the greater the tax burden consumers will absorb. That is a fact. Derry should be working to make this town as good as it can be not sweating the tax rate. If we go the other way we have a future of economic decline that will only lower property values and make the tax rate climb. There is an endless list of towns and cities in America that have fallen into this downward spiral. Look at Lawrence of Berlin. Once you hit the bottom it takes generations to improve. Newark NJ might never get there and it has been 100 years and BILLIONS of dollars.
Why do you guess about things when you are obviously clueless? Don’t make statements as if you know when you can be so wrong .
You are a smart guy. By spouting off to influence others and being so wrong why should your positions be takes seriously about anything else?
Sit on the sidelines for a while; have a hotdog.
Carl;
While math is not his forte, I think anon 1:30 is onto something. When you actually work the numbers (as he clearly hasn't), based upon anon's $30k premium for living in a surrounding town here's how it works out:
You are better off in Derry than Londonderry IF YOUR HOME IN Derry IS WORTH LESS THAN $300k!!! (Calculations based on NH Dept of Revenue Admin. 2009 rate rates and a 30 year mortgage on the $30k home price delta).
However if, rather than Londonderry, one chose Auburn that equal payment mark moves down to $190K. (you are better off in Derry than Auburn only if your house in Derry is worth less than $190k.)
For Chester (where the kids still go to Pinkerton) the equal payment mark goes to $240k.
The savings for the more affluent to live in surrounding towns can be considerable. A $500k home value homeowner pays $104,000 less over 30 years living in Auburn than Derry and has a home he or she can sell for $30k more. Perhaps this is the reason that, to the best of my knowledge, no homes have sold for over $400k in Derry in about 18 months. We are uncompetitive in the middle and high ends of the market.
We are a good deal to someone wanting to buy a $150k home (and pay $4,182 in taxes). Hope they don't have any children (cost per child for Derry education approximately $10k/year.)
So this is the essence of our economics. Our home values would need to drop another 10 to 20% vs surrouonding communities to become competitive for moderately affluent homeowners. This is the price we will pay for Derry's unique style of government.
Doug Newell
While I'm on this site, let me go back to the 4A topic. BC does meeting with a representative of a dead corporation constitute a séance? Did any furniture move while you were talking to that guy? Were there candles and spooky music? We don't need a Town Council we need Ghost Busters!
DJN,
The more you talk the more i realize you dont know what your talking about. Do you always shoot from the hip? Im wondering if you had a chance to see the UL article today about 4A. Doug, you really need to pick and choose your words more carefully.
lol....LOL!! anon pilot i think the better question would be, have you ever had a mind??
here's a simple history lesson for you. i have offered a civil dialogue with you a number of occasions. it is you that has decided to continue to remain hidden in the clouds.
until you have the guts to address me with your name attached, as far as i am concerned you're grounded santa......he's a pilot too.
Totally expected response from you Carl.
No response of any substance just chest thumping again. Your thought process is totally irrelevant in this discussion as your “anonymous fixation” just overwhelms your thinking. Carl with input like yours Derry is doomed to spiral downward into economic oblivion. You are a textbook example of “monitoring the wrong gauge.”
If even a slim majority of inhabitants, embodied by you and Doug Newell, continue to focus on taxes as a way to move Derry forward “God help us all”.
Carl,
You are such a idiot.
Outside of exposing blowhard bullys there is a paper trail of everything you have written.....and the blog has them all!
Take a pill Zippy
I will expose some of your best.
Ther are 4 posts where is some meandering and bloviating way you claim that everything BUT tax rate is why people buys houses.
Must be you life on the field friends?
To quote you from 1/9/09 at 8:17 AM
Actions have consequences!
1/9/09 8:17 AM
Anyone read the op-ed in Monday's Union Leader? It's from one of our neighbors who loves Derry but is leaving because of the tax rate. He says Derry is the most mismanaged town in the state. (And there are a lot of towns in New Hampshire… “We’re number 1!” “We’re number 1!”… Oops…)
He compares our tax rate to maggots feeding on the people of Derry until there will be nothing left but a carcass of empty homes. BC you voted for all those excessive fire contracts; school board you voted for fat teacher pay raises as hundreds of people were losing their jobs, past councils who threw money at your buddies in DEDC and dumped $1 million into Exit 4A, where is your rebuttal? Please explain to the man why he should pay twice the taxes to live in this town. I’m sure the readers of the Union Leader are waiting for your responses.
2/9/09 12:20 PM
2/9/09 2:52 PM are both too long and ranting to list here!
3:47, prove yourself not worthy of belonging to this "rarified group." I invite you, anon 3:47, to once again try your best to present your thoughts by addressing specifically, the primary point in my response to BC, ie: the relative tax rate impact upon home valuations.
If this invitation proves to troublesome and/or difficult for you to attempt, be sure of one thing, I never have and never will suffer fools and their dishonesty. Also be advised I am justifiably prejudiced against those that lack conviction in their posts as evidenced by their hiding behide the appropriate and cowardly pseudonym "anonymous."
I am confident in the knowledge that i am in the good company of the majority that understand my position.
CVA
ps thanks for the return call.
2/9/09 7:27 PM
anon pilot....aka santa, you are a real piece of work aren't you.
let's review what YOU want people to know about you based upon your posts:
-you distort others positions.
-you are willing to lie to support a point.
-you are incapable of staying on topic.
-you are an embarassment to this community.
-you are gutless.
there is little wonder you choose to remain as real as santa and his flying reindeers, anon pilot. offer something up with substance for a change. until then, you remain as vapid as the hot air you expel.
but hey, i'm a good guy. i again offer you the chance to kick around any ideas that you may have that could make derry a better place.
let's see if you can raise the bar that was initially set low by YOU. i am getting bored of flying over your head.
if it turns out you have no ideas, i would be glad to throw one out.
Carl, I am a hot dog eating pickup truck owner. I will even sign my name. I think you are a donkey. Pickup trucks are the number one selling vehicle in the Us. They are handy in our winters, trips to the transfer station, and picking up supplies. But since I disagree with your views, I am a pickup truck hick.
I read this blog to see what people are thinking, but I had to post after seeing your holier than thou diatribe.
Youe friend,
Joe Purcell
anon 3:53, YOU asked around about ME, in my hometown?
lol....lol......LOL!!!!!
hey, next time you pick up lunch at d'agostino's say hello to ralph for me. i'll tell him you'll be stopping by.....do you go by a-non or mouse?
---------------------------------------
folks, through this blog i sure have gained a new perspective on some members of our community. those that don't know me well i apologize if any of my responses have offended you. but at times communication has to be adapted to address specific audience members.
the interesting and concerning thing is, having resided in derry over 15 years i have only run into a handful of dopey darlings like the ones i have been "dialoguing" with on brian's blog. they are anonymous anomalies.
oh yeah, brian; i want to assure you know, i have ZERO intention of "taking over" your blog (whatever the hell that means.) you once actually assured everyone of this in response to a posters concern. we all clearly see how hard you have worked on your blog over the past few years. keep up the good work.
CVA
joe, no offense meant to hot dog eaters; i stop by t-birds myself. but i hear they can affect vision if you eat too many.
better get your eye's check sport, i look nothing like a donkey.
as for pick-up trucks, why don't you everyone just where you think i said anything negative about pick-up trucks ?? once you've done that, get off my ass. (get it???...a little pick-up truck humor.)
hey joe purcell, thanks for having the decency to use your name. please, feel free to introduce yourself to me one day.
CVA
Stop blogging. You just keep getting yourself in deeper. When I compared owning properties in other locations I was not talking about Mommy and Daddys house, Carl.
Carl,
Here is a suggestion:
Background: Derry is about to lose $7.5+ MM in school funding. Yet Ms. Fairbanks asked what Mr. Gould was doing in Concord about it. A. She did not know what is going on B. She did not know our Mr. Gould. C. She and the Town Council have no organized response to the impending crisis and are not working with our Statehouse Representatives.
I say little in support of Janet as I think that she is hopeless. But a flash of light is Technicolor to the blind and something triggered the rat on the wheel in her brain and out came an original thought for once. We should seize the opportunity!
I suggest that the Derry TC organize a public hearing with our state reps to openly discuss options and strategies to protect this money.
Ok Carl? Now your turn.
PS. BC feel free to chime in as you have a dog in this hunt.
anon 10:16,
I will chime in. The 7.5 Million has been dangled for awhile now. Our state reps and school board have known for some time. I know we have a meeting to meet with all the chairs of the boards and we use to have a meeting with our reps once a year. I think Mr.Mets will be calling one soon.
The issue remains that whatever we dont get from the state doesn't automatically mean taxpayers have to make up the difference.. School board does have other alternatives. Some people may not like however they do have options. Council has no jurisdiction however can chime in.
Carl,
I think you enjoy stirring the pot. Nothing wrong with that until you go too far. We know each others names but I would never want to assocaite with you. You are not someone I would want to be around.
Joe Purcell
CV, I asked about you in businesses along Washington and Mt. Vernon Streets. Still waiting for one person to say they have heard of you. But I guess knowing the woner of where you eat is something. Do they serve hot dogs there?
anon 10:16, slow day in the market today so i will chime in.......i could not agree with you more. right BC?
i have spoken with BC and other council members as well as some rep's about this as recently as a couple of months ago.
CVA
--------------------------------------
too bad...... but my invitation still stands. hey joe, ever wonder why derry politics is so polarized?
anon 10:25, of course they serve hot dogs there, just walk in, i am sure they'd serve you right away.
Carl,
Please use Capitalization and Punctuation. Remember communication is in the execution!
Signed: (cowardly) English Teacher
You are helping to polarize politics here in Derry CVA. What is wrong with disagreeing with other opinions? Rather than respecting other opinions, you refer to them as hot dog eating, pickup truck driving, people in the stands.
What if we all agreed to disagree politely and kept on point, rather than mudslinging? Make a p[olicy that BC deletes any personal attacks.
Joe Purcell
My apologies to everyone on the blog.
I have let this go too far with Carl. It has been me that has stirred the pot on the blog. Carl was simply a hapless participant who showed the ability to tripped over his own personality and bludgeon everybody with his perspective.
This is what happens in Derry.
Everyone is so convinced with his or her rightness that they try to browbeat their positions into everybody else.
Commonality bands common thinking together and we have polarization.
A few activists organize and the ADT or its antecedents are formed. Savvy politicians recognize the power inherent in the group and we have factions supporting the polarization.
As a result nothing gets done. Small dust ups derail progress on larger issues. Personal vendettas are supported by rumor and innuendo. What starts as well meaning civic involvement of individuals becomes “Lord of the Flies.”
The requirement of getting beyond this is to recognize it. Derry has to have a cohesive direction where everyone is rowing in the same general direction towards the betterment of Derry.
Who is the leader this town needs? He or she is here but not among the factions, on either side. Our after we put aside our egos and saber rattling our primary objective is to find that leader.
My sincerest apologies to Carl and anyone else that might have been offended. It could have easily been any ones of us on this blog that believed so fervently in their position.
I look forward to meeting Carl some day. Maybe we can take a flight together!
anon 12:02, you sly dog you.....i sure did step into your trap didn't i? ....(oh brother).....
okay....i know i am going out on a limb here, but i will assume that it is actually derry's one and only "anon pilot" that penned 12:02. so.....that said
ring me up one day, i'd be glad to go over some of the constructive things i have been involved with over the years. likewise i'd be glad to hear what you have done as well.
but more importantly, i'd be happy to hear your thoughts on what can be done to make things more, shall i say "leafy" here in good old derry.
i am sure we can get much done working towards a common goal, despite your ingenius ploy.....you sly dog.
hey pilot, maybe you could talk some patience into joe. if you have occasion to speak with him tell him i am in fact a civil guy.; but i do meet fire with fire, always have and always will.
as for you BC, wtf??? when will you and all seven of your council cronies and our one hundred and one state reps do something to make us all want to give each other a great big group hug again?
the rail trail was a great start. remember , the vote was 6 to 1 in favor BC and it is already paying dividends.....imagine that!!
but damn, for the life of me BC, i can't remember who the one dissenting vote was. lol...LOL!!
well you've heard the last from me for a while. hey, anon pilot do you fly to hpn?
have a terrific thanksgiving all. it's been real.....real....something.
CVA
3:30
Anyone that uses wtf is childish and not worthy of even getting their post approved.
Carl,
To use modern vernacular, you got "pwned like a noob" by your pilot friend.
What is worse he proved his point and you went right back and acted like a jack*** again.
Park you ego, shut up and stay off the blog.
Come on everybody lay off CVA. He hung himself on his own lead making himself irrelevant in future discussions. I only wish that we could do the same to Burtis, Cardon and Newell whose frequent diatribes using arcane facts spun as truth lose 99% of the Derry population like Mozart for the deaf.
Start working on the solutions. Don't let the egos of small minds keep us trapped. Find a real leader not some bumkisser for either faction. Where is Art McLean when we need him!
anon 8:52 & 7:05.......lighten up children.
three points for you both to mull over.
first anon 8:52, a heart felt "kma" to your suggestion that i or anyone stay off the blog. rest assured i will post whenever i feel the need.
i, unlike you will sign my name to everything i post and will continue to do so until BC acknowledges the potential harm done permitting anonymous clowns to post smack and suffer no accountibility .
secondly, my use of "wtf" and now "kma." well....i am so very sorry if my use of either of these two acronyms offended your so very derry refined sensitivities.
tell me hypocrite 7:05, where are your "mature" condemnations of the vile names that people of every stripe have been referred to as on this blog?
sure.....it is a very difficult question to answer, especially honestly........and especially to some one like me who has on occasion come to peoples defense on this blog when one of your kindred truly immature anonymous posters have put their IQ's and barnyard upbringing on public display.
no harm done, i will not hold my breath for your response. however maybe upon reflection, my question will give you pause should you feel like getting high. mighty and hypocritical again.
now go make a turkey sandwich and enjoy your day as best you can.
CVA
7:05 you have no problem with BC allowing endless, pointless and now downright boring personal attacks on this blog but when it comes to wtf, you draw the line. Attacking people yes, implied obsenities no? WTF?
You folks pushed me over the edge.
You are not the kind of people I chum around with in real life so I certainly won't in cyber life either.
SO long!!
BC I am surprised you would allow this type of language never mind insults and name calling of others.
See you in March at the election.
From 7:05
BC,
I'd say 7:05 might have once been a supporter of yours. I'm delighted that your refusal to enforce civility is costing you votes.
"#1) The town has already obligated itself to spending $5 Million Dollars back in the late 80's by two prior Mayors and boards of selectman. There is documentation to prove this."
OK PROVE IT. Bring forth the documentation and make it public. Otherwise we must assume that this is bluff and posturing.
Post a Comment